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I do hold evidences as many people do throughout this planet, and I don't say that I hold more

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than the other individuals nor less. I hold evidences that indicate to mankind, on the

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whole, if properly submitted, that we do have an interplanetary intelligence visiting the

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Earth, a board of craft commonly called a flying saucer, or a fagantious craft, and there

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are many other shapes involved, but commonly termed a flying saucer. We have evidences

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indicating this to be a fact, and that there are strange crafts in our atmosphere that are

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interplanetary machines. None is physical, none is physical. I'm not thinking of any

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metaphysical, or shall we say, another method of land is that of it has been brought into

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the subject, inadvertently by some, and by others. I'm not thinking of that at all. We

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can discuss that in the later this evening because we have evidences in this direction

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too. The point is that we do have a physical tangible craft that is visiting this Earth,

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and I'm going to tell Mal, which something I don't normally do, is tell her my own

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opinion in one deal. Just one moment, I have no shoe in part of the word A. Is it just

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one single craft, or are you of the belief that there are many, many, many, many, many,

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very many? And I have only been involved in my particular sightings as such, and

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experiences I have only been involved in, and a few of the types. I have not seen all

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of them, but I am willing to accept some of the evidences submitted. I'm willing to

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accept if I have seen a Model A board going down the street after having arrived upon

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this planet, shall we say, I see a Model A board going down the street. I'm willing to

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accept the fact that there must be several other models around who besides Model A

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board. It's quite obvious. Because I haven't seen these craft the other man has seen,

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I'm not going to reject his tale, nor am I going to reject the validity of his sightings.

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However, the sightings that I have made, many of them, rather astounding. It shocked me

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into the belief, rather than, shall we say, just a guesstimate of what was going on. My

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guesses were pretty good way back in 1950. I felt that what I had uncovered at that time

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was very good, that I had enough proof to even carry it before the public. I've been working

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on it for a number of years before then, but I remain rather quiet. And I felt that I

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didn't have enough evidence. I had the belief and I had a feeling that something was going

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on, but I couldn't help the other people of my belief. I could only express this when

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I had proof. And when these little experiences amplify themselves through the years and then

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you become involved, we'll see the same thing that the man that you were investigating

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and seeing, it gives you this experience of being able to smell what the man is, and I

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use the term smell, it's a terminology. You're able to smell out the fraud and the phony.

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And we have a lot of them in the field. They can't be helped. An ethical topic, an ethical

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topic, a series of events that are going on today, I've found to draw everything. The

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bottom of the bucket is found to come in and cover up the field with their business information

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as it were. It makes it difficult for it. Very difficult. However, one of the outstanding

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sightings that I recall very vividly, and as I said before, I want everybody to understand

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that I do not normally, even on some very, very, in some very dire circumstances where

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I have to defend myself, I normally don't express my own personal experiences in the field.

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You lose the sight of being a reporter when you do, and when you're trying to investigate

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the other man and you're trying to compile a lot of other data, it's very difficult for

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a man to look at his own experiences other than just experiences. However, I'm going to

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tell you one tonight. I want all of you to make no comments if you wish, because there's

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some very important things that are going to bring a lot of questions up in your mind.

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So these questions will all be answered in a very few moments when I, as I would say,

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express what I have seen. And if you listen to it intently, you will understand what I

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have seen. And it won't create a whole lot of questions if you listen. But if you don't

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listen, you're going to have a whole lot of questions that are really irrelevant.

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I was driving to a flying saucer convention on the West Coast. Max Miller had put over

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the flying saucer convention, the very first one in the field, and at the Hollywood Hotel.

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And I had wanted to get to this convention probably. I would have gone on all fours.

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I couldn't afford it like every one of the other saucer researchers. It's very difficult to keep up with

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the expenses involved in this thing. But I was going to make the West Coast in that convention

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if it hurt. And I had headed out there three days prior to the convention. And I'm rather

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interested in such things as the history of man, the antiquities of man. I love such places

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as the Cooks Wellies, the Grand Canyon area, and then of course the crater out there,

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Winslow, Arizona. I had been there before, but my boy hadn't seen it. So we spent all

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of one day going through the crater talking to Dr. Ninja, whom I know, incidentally for

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anybody that wants to study a little bit about meteors and meteorites. You get a hold of

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Dr. Minnichard's books. They're very good. And the man is very objective in what he is doing.

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He, incidentally, is wondering why he can't see flying saucers because he's doing a lot of observing.

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He thinks he has to be some sort of a specialized individual to see them. But anyhow, I spent

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a lot of time with Dr. Ninja, introduced my son to him. My son is quite interested in astronomy

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and a lot of related subjects and not particularly in the interest in saucers, I might say, even though

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his dad is. And we spent two hours around there and then we filled a lot of time in

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White Staff, Arizona, the old Cooks Wellings, or rather interesting sort of Cooks Wellings

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there. These have always intrigued me. And after spending a lot of time around there, we

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took off, I'd say about 10.30 at night, we got down the needles. And needles was awful hot.

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It was really hot. And I won't give a few in temperatures. All I can say is it was extremely

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uncomfortable. And I have failed for ships in the early days at a 130, 140 degrees

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temperature down in the N.H. room and that was really hot. So what I'd say was really hot

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out there at needles, I mean it, I really felt it. We left needles California after

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gassing up and I wanted to throw the better a lot on the desert. I decided it was too hot to do so

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here. And all these desert winds blowing in in the prevailing Easterry and as they

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pushed it into the foot of the mountains there, it was just stirring around the beat.

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My voice on the sweep on the front seat of the car and I started to drive westward to get into the

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high desert country towards Barstow. And I thought I can't make the first night of the

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playing soft to convention but who gives a damn, there's two other nights to go. So I'll get into

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the L.A. when I feel like it rather than try to get through the night. As early as the

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morning was night anymore, it was the next morning, it was around 1.30 to 2 o'clock when we

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headed out across the desert. And I'd say we were out of town about 20 minutes west of

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needle California. And I had the funniest, itty-bitty sensation that something was following my car.

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Now of course some of these people in flames off the research will say, haha, these are ESP

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contacts, a telephoto contact. This, I don't say this, it took place, it couldn't possibly have been a ESP

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contact to set to my part. Because I did not pick it up in that manner, but I had this funny hunch

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that we had something following my car. And I was extremely alert, looking around throughout

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the sky, left and right and overhead, even throwing my hand out, because this is a beautiful

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country for sightings. You can see that star coverage is just like a blanket over you out there.

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It's pretty hard to pick anything up, but if there was anything at all that moved up there that was not

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normal to what we're accustomed to seeing at the moment, you would know it very quickly.

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So I'm very nervous, it's every looking around, just like the bird looking for the prey. Actually,

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I thought it was a prey at the moment. And looking behind the car, there was an elongated cloud, dark

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mass. And this persisted through a period of about 15 to 20 minutes. Yet I had, I really think about it,

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because it took me 15 minutes to wake up to the fact that here was a cloudless sky and a desert.

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What was an elongated cloud doing there by, I mean, I'm traveling 80 or 90 miles an hour, and it was

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very easily, well, what could come over the cloud doing there and cling to that close to the car.

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And suddenly when I, there was a minute that I admitted to myself that this was something unusual,

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it was a little different. And I took a rapid scan, and as my eyes went that way, there was a burst of light.

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And it was just like, well, it was frightening, for the simple reason that when this light burst, as it said, in my eyes,

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I felt that my cat is a ship landing on the desert, and it's just landing here, and his landing lights

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have flashed on right over my car, and he hit me. This is a strange feeling that you get this reaction.

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But it was a tremendous burst of light. And in this burst of light, suddenly, as my eyes, and I

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started to attention to what it was, and my eyes were accustomed to it, and I want you to understand,

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it was all momentarily, it wasn't something that would take 15 to 20 minutes, to view 15 to 20 minutes,

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as I was trying to guess what an adjustment there was, fractional. And there was a large,

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the gar-shaped craft. The elongated clouds that I saw, the dark mass, is the only thing I could suspect

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of this being, because it wasn't there anymore, and here was this beautiful bright, bluish-white light, and the gar-shaped.

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And now I'm going to give you the so-called researches, or enthusiasm, to find something to shock.

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This particular craft was the blunt-ended, a Dansky's mother-type ship, out there beyond my car,

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traveling in the same direction, and I'm doing, as I said, about 90 to 95 going west, and there was this craft

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out there, glowing, in the blunt-end, cold, hard, solid lines of a vehicle, not any spherical substance,

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but a good, clear, hard vehicle, and blended on both ends, not conducive to space travel

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or aerodynamic travel, as we know it, and in this place, like the drowdy man, because this is all in seconds,

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that I, how long he paused there, for my benefit, I'm sure, is that he paused right through the line of my reading,

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and not a formal limit, not a thing on this craft, but just beautiful, cylindrical in shape,

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and I think that I used the term beautiful, because it was, you could feel, you could feel that there was something about a craft of that type,

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hovering out there over the desert without a projection on it, not a way on it, nothing, and not a sound,

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and yet this, this glow, it lit up the desert far brighter than the lightning, and yet it had a lightning,

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and light quality, the bluish-white light, and I would judge, this is only a guess, I would judge this thing,

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to be, to have been, approximately half a mile away from my car, and approximately half a mile in altitude,

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and it filled two thirds of my two-door, old 88, coach door, that's, that is the two-door, the larger door,

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and the, as you, it isn't the four-door, the narrow window, so for those of you that are driving cars with narrow windows,

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George, you were going to think of a smaller craft than what I have in mind, but for those of you that drive the larger windows of automobiles,

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two thirds of that left window of my car was filled with this beautiful texture, it was awe-inspiring,

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to see a craft of this nature, on the hovering over there, over the desert, literally hovering over there,

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and a few seconds, and I got this high-pitched, and then he moved off, and as he moved off, he didn't disappear,

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like some people say, oh, he disappeared, you were going to say that immediately,

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and those of you that called interpretation are going to say, oh, he disappeared, even though it was a metaphysical something,

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it's just their vanishing, math and D math, materialization and D materials, they can be moved,

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which he quickly jumped to this conclusion, the word's not, he moved off rapidly,

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in fact, four and one-half seconds from the time that he was down to the moon,

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he moved through the gradually increased speed, he just didn't start out,

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but in four and a half seconds, he was knowing that a bright star to the west, another very bright star,

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and I watched that, and you will know that you would watch something like that,

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all eyes, I'm trying to pinch my boy and co-hop him over their hands while he's on the seat,

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to wake him up, to see the sighting of the ages, it might have to make this,

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and now my personal opinion on this has always been that I could play with the guy who's craft is exciting,

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I don't know why I just have, maybe it's because I have been in the field of rocketry and aircraft for so many years,

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and I feel that there's, if the guy's been craft, it's more conducive to man's efforts in this direction, maybe so.

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However, it was the one, if the guy says craft that I had seen, it was really astounding,

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and nobody can tell me that this was an earthly vehicle, nobody can tell me that this was not something built other than on this planet,

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where I don't know, I haven't the slightest guess where he's seen from, or how many people were aboard,

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I do feel though that there were intelligence in the form of that craft, this is something that you would say will just quickly hunch,

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and it is, I have no proof that there were any intelligences out there other than my own particular height,

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that here's a craft, and it seems people, as such, or intelligence in other words, who were, he says,

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to utilize the craft of this type, that they were empirical and they said,

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what in the world do they need a craft of that type for? They didn't use any empirical,

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that means they travel, what do they need a craft of that type for?

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I'm sure that he built that craft for my specific benefit, this I am very sure of, they didn't build that for my benefit,

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nor did some, some shall we say, Teister, give me some optical illusion of some sort, this was very real.

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Now there wasn't a sound to this craft when it moved off,

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but I mean it believes that it is not utilizing normal propulsion beings, it is physically impossible, and impossible,

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I would say, to decide what the design of any craft is, unless we know it beforehand,

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other than having a fixed sound, some of the two different positions and then matching their notes.

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However, in this particular case, I would say that this craft was, intuitively, as always you give me an astronaut,

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and intuitively I would say that this was at least four and one half times the size of the Queen Mary.

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This was the very least it could have been, it could have been larger, but I don't know it's exact distance from me,

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nor do I know it's exact altitude, I don't know any of these factors, and I have nothing to be made of you at all,

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so I can say that intuitively I would guess it to be, and my guess would be very wrong,

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but I would say that it was not any smaller, any less than four and one half times the size of the Queen Mary,

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as we thought a mile long, this was me, roughly a mile long.

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Look, selling your windshield, or your, you're not the windshield, selling your side door, the car, two thirds of that,

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there's given me the immensity of this craft, it's far beyond anything that I thought could be a result on this earth.

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I have my level-one, seven-inch of the air, particular amount of protection for heavy hands from the inside like that,

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and I've grown up a world a couple of times. You said something about four and a half seconds,

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yeah, it was just an approximately four to five seconds ago, and it was never that, I'd say, it was breaded.

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Now, it seems to me that you mentioned that there was a meaning of the flying stop's international,

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that you and your son could at least be able to get two days of the convention,

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you said you were not going to force it to drive there because it's the first day.

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I'm just thinking of questions that I feel that many of the people on the party line would like to present,

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if they had the opportunity that I have tonight to, by all interviewing, by all means,

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do you feel that due to the length of this trip, it wasn't a very long trip, not for me, actually,

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and just from that from Alaska, I just covered your last trip.

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Well, I'm talking about the amount of mileage that you were trying to make in a very,

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usually, what, in Chicago?

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Yeah, I was driving from Chicago to L.A. at the time, about 20 to 300 miles, yeah, about 2,300 miles.

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Do you think there's a possibility, John, that you were hired and that this may have been a hallucination?

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Well, that's a very good question.

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It's coming from you.

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I rather the question is intense because do I look tired now?

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No, not at this.

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I've been up all night, all night, all three nights.

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I mean, the relationship again brings up the problem.

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I'm going to ask you a question, please.

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I'm not invading you, but I wasn't going to bring up the problem of understanding one man and another.

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I can stay up for a week without any sleep and get away with it and still be wide awake.

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Another man in a major statement, because another man's W.R.M. maybe looking for a fellow.

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Yeah, another man.

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Another man who's been there for 15 minutes, he had his bedtime and he's a collapsed individual.

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And I believe that's what you were trying to do, right, Brad?

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When I am in a collapsed condition, another room that I have been under a state of hallucination,

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I would say most definitely not.

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In my estimation, however, I know that there are psych-high-insist about someone saying,

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ha, ha, ha, this is me for the fire.

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This boy was really tired.

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I have driven to California, quote me.

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I have driven to California and I know you can get awful, awful tired.

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You can see a lot of strange things in the desert, brown-up black-nosed blades.

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A man talking, I was tonight before,

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and he had to see him, Allison, on talking about how many straw-on-allices he had in his analysis.

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Oh, I would have loved to have been here that night.

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I tried to call you.

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Why didn't you open up your telephone?

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I wasn't here.

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You weren't here.

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You were in New York, but open up the telephone at about this.

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There's a guy on the West Coast that does this.

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Ben Hunter has a program that's much like yourself.

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When the incident we went to talk about him, because there was a very exciting face message

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or arrangement made over that broadcast, and I want to tell the audience about it.

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But then, as the telephone opens, and at the specific hours of the morning,

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and the audience call in, and many of them call, long distance,

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and those that are the preferedness may call, collect,

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and this fellow does a terrific job on the same subject that he does.

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Well, we find that if we take Shones on as an example,

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if I took the phones here and now, we wouldn't have an interview.

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Well, that's true, but I mean, I want to express this,

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that he does have interviews much like you do,

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and then again, he has interviews with these telephone callers.

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Consequently, he's always got the live program of getting new material at all times over that telephone.

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He doesn't have to wait for them to come in, and when they come in, that makes it even better.

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From the moment that he can talk to them longer than them,

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but he holds 15, 20-minute conversations over the phone,

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and people speak of subjects unrelated to the call interpretation

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of various things in medicine and doctors,

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and he goes around there all the time, one to five every morning, with things he does.

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And these are invaluable, and of course, for a while,

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we have tried that from time to time,

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and we find that the person making the call is very much interested in the conversation,

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but the people on the party line want to get back to listening to John Otto and Carlton Hason.

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That's who's at this point.

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I'm not going to have an argument on this.

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We'll wrap that tiredness just for a moment.

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I just wondered, I've heard this statement used time and time again,

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and I think that you sort of incorporated it, not just words for words,

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and that is, you have to believe to see,

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and I'm of nature that I want to see before I believe.

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I'm not entirely in accord with that statement, that I cut the piece off from all the rest.

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In other words, what, right?

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And I hear you two statements.

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Well, the one, why do people believe to see, or can you see to believe, and then believe?

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I would say that to answer that, I haven't found that to be the case entirely.

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I have found that the people that have absolutely no concept of what's going on in this ethical topic at all,

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have seen, and that probably have probably been more astounding of the writing.

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Those people that haven't, they find this concept.

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Now, to find out whether these people, in their way of living, are any different than the others,

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I have never found any evidence indicating this at all,

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but I have found people that haven't had the slightest concept to go along with this,

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haven't had the slightest experience at all,

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haven't even been, shall we say, exposed to a newspaper article on the subject,

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and this feels pretty hard, not very good, but it is, because it seems that way,

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but then again, a lot of people wouldn't even notice that.

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Their eyes are still right through a newspaper, their rape is still alive,

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also reporting what's happening when you can think of it.

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And yet, some of these people have been subject,

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going back to the earlier days and sources, that the terminology was,

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behind sight, this is used a lot in co-interpretations, incidentally,

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behind sight of man, he, the, the, the kind of looking here in a direction for no reason at all,

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and suddenly seeing something.

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Well, these people haven't had what you could call a belief they get they saw.

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So I wouldn't say that this is, so, I wouldn't say this is,

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if you had to believe this.

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Are you a resident of California?

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I will be very shortly.

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I'm a resident of Chicago, Illinois, as the President,

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and I, because I have made my, making a permanent move to the West Coast,

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and been doing so, I'm still a resident of Chicago, though.

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Flying, Starter's, International, Unmetaphysical Group?

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Most definitely not.

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There's, some people have stated that from time to time,

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that I'm showing you at this moment a bulldozer that is turned off quarterly by Max Miller,

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applying software to International, he's called, Soft-Bird.

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And the, there's some very interesting little bits on the flying software research, as such,

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that are submitted from time to time.

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I would like to say that Max Miller is in layer zone,

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with a lot of very interesting people in, and on our planet.

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This man has a reputation, that is rather outstanding.

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People respect his evaluating ability.

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They respect him to the extent that he is given confidential information from time to time.

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I'm not trying to lead you to the need that you will find that any confidential information

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published in his book, that you won't find elsewhere.

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But I would like to tell you that he comes up with many firsts in the field.

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Many firsts, many people have thought, though that all flying software researchers or enthusiasts

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are, uh, of occult readings, and this is far from the truth.

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However, I have found, in my, my particular investigation, that many people that are interested in the topic,

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eventually start investigating the occult, or start investigating the metaphysical interpretation.

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This, I think, is, is a natural, you should, but I do not believe, and I believe this is what the FI was trying to express,

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and I didn't wish to be trite or smart at the time when I said it,

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but I do believe that this organization, uh, was trying to express, in their opinion,

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they didn't feel that occult interpretation should be considered flying software,

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and in this, I thoroughly agree, that occult, as such, as a research,

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I do believe that occult research is a very valid and a very real, uh, topic of, uh,

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discretion of investigation, and I think that men should know about it.

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I think all men that are ready should know about it, but I do not believe that it is healthy for people to say

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that you must have occult knowledge to understand flying software,

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and I don't believe it has any part of the flying software something.